Teacher Shift

Put Your Career Shift Mindset to Work

May 03, 2023 Alexandra Simon & JoDee Scissors Episode 57
Teacher Shift
Put Your Career Shift Mindset to Work
Show Notes Transcript

Today, Ali and JoDee are chatting with Bobby DeLong, a former band educator of 9 years who has transitioned into a career as a mortgage loan officer. Together, they’ll discuss the catalyst that led to Bobby’s transition, the skills necessary to becoming a good mortgage loan officer and why you should get rid of the “this or that” mentality.


Connect with Bobby:
Website: https://homeloanswithbobby.com
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/robert-delong-510398200/
Facebook: Bobby DeLong



Connect with Ali and JoDee:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/teachershift
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/teachershift
Teacher Shift LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/teacher-shift
Ali’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alisimon/
JoDee’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jodeescissors/

Website
https://www.teachershiftpodcast.com/

Episode Transcriptions
https://www.teachershiftpodcast.com/blog

Ali  0:00  
All teachers are natural innovators, entertainers and problem solvers. They dream of growing old into the profession, teaching their kids kids. But sometimes career goals shift or change, and that makes opportunities outside of the classroom seem intangible questioning who am I, if I'm not a teacher? I'm your host, Alexandra Simon.

JoDee  0:30  
And I'm your co host, JoDee Scissors.

Ali  0:34  
This is The Great Teacher Resignation.

Today, our guest is Bobby DeLong. Bobby is a former band educator of nine years. He remains active in the band community, but has pivoted into a full time job as a mortgage loan officer and is loving it. Welcome to the show today, Bobby.

Bobby  0:58  
Thanks for having me.

Ali  0:59  
Thanks for being here. You have such an interesting story. And we're really eager to learn about your transition. We know that you went from the band room to home lending, which is adding to many channels that teachers can think about when they consider a new career path. And you told us that you're really loving the transition. So can you tell us, what is it exactly that you're loving?

Bobby  1:20  
So I'm really liking the ability to coach people. The home buying process is scary. And it is the largest financial decision and purchase that they're probably going to do in their life. Other than maybe, you know, college and and all that money goes with that. So I kind of like holding their hand. I like coaching them on what product might be best for them. And just like clearly communicating, you know, what they might need to do. The steps they need to do to get in that home and to purchase that home.

Ali  1:54  
And how did you decide to go into this field? You're the first former teacher that we've interviewed who's gone into home lending or you know, mortgages?

Bobby  2:02  
Yeah, so I am pretty geeky with finances, with investing. My parents were entrepreneurs. My granddad was an entrepreneur. My in laws are entrepreneurs. And I kind of thought about maybe going into financial planning, maybe something like that. My best friend is a financial planner and has talked to me about that a lot. But then my wife and my mother in law, who are real estate agents, and are very active in the real estate community around here. They're like, hey, what if you help people with their mortgages and their financing? Because again, it is a very scary, murky water that a lot of people don't know about, especially the millennial generation, who are all coming up to first time home buying age right now: 34 to 37. So I thought about it. And yeah, I thought about it and checked out all the education that I needed to do and the test. And I went for it. I was lucky enough to have a lot of time off during COVID to study and to look at the test, which we'll talk about a little bit later. And overall, I acsent it and went for it. 

JoDee  3:17  
It sounds like you have a good team around you that was able to help you make some decisions, guide you. See what kind of potential you have in other industries. And I really liked that about your story. I want to go back to something that you had talked about with us when we were first introduced. And it goes back to you know, you being in the classroom. And I want to know a little bit about what was kind of the catalyst for you deciding to leave. You had mentioned that there is this factory style way of learning in public schools, and it's just not working for a lot of teachers. And can you tell us a little bit more about that? And what was kind of the decision that led you to leave?

Bobby  4:04  
This is a difficult topic to tackle because I don't necessarily have the answer. So much of the you know, America's public school systems and private school systems, it's factory style. Set 6, 7 classes a day, pumped the kids in and out, 50 minutes. Hopefully they learned something. In my case, I was a band director. So the kids had noisemakers in their hands. And they're in middle school, so there's maturity issues there as well. One thing that's not working particularly for students is the ability to meet their educational needs. In my master's, we talked a lot about differentiated instruction. It was really hard to get the kids what they needed, especially I had a class it was 55 students. Again all with noisemakers in their hands. So there's so many things that came out of the band experience that were good: teamwork, working towards one goal as a group, all of that stuff hard works, finishing. But one thing that's not working particularly for students is they're really not getting specific instruction on what they need. Are they an audible learner? Are they kinesthetic? Are they visual? You know, it's kind of an attack on the senses, sometimes, in a classroom, and you hope they got something.

JoDee  5:31  
Yeah, I do a lot of research around sensory and music because I work with several arts organizations where we're trying to work towards making musical experiences more enjoyable for any audience member. And it takes a lot of extra professional development on my part, a lot of literature, a lot of learning about different styles of learning and needs, and what it looks like when you see someone overstimulated or not learning in the way that is best for them. So it's a lot of tough work that you have to do to differentiate and when you have a class of 55 students, that is really challenging.

Bobby  6:08  
Absolutely. Another thing, what's not working for teachers in the factory style. Every year, I would go to different music conventions for educators. Every single year, there is a class on teacher burnout. Six classes a day. You have a conference period. You have a lunch. You do an hour or two of desk work afterwards. In the music world, you're studying repertoire to make sure you're picking the right music for your kiddos. You're planning for the next day. That's a lot of stuff. And it's a constant teaching throughout that 50 minutes. In band, it's not give them a worksheet. They turn in at the end of class. You were doing a constant feedback loop with them throughout the full 50 minutes. And at the end of the day, you're just like, a vegetable sometimes. So I wonder if that's sustainable for teachers for 30 years?

Ali  7:08  
That's something that I have been talking with JoDee about a lot. The sustainability part of 30 years. I think you really, you really have something there. I think it's all the things that you just explained. But it's also the reality that  as a culture and as a society, people are not staying in the same profession for 30 years. Like most people are not they're doing something for a few years, and maybe they go into something else. And, and really what you learn in your previous careers, helps build you up and make you the person you are to go into your next career. Takes me to my next question. I have a theater and arts background. And I know that that's really helped me a lot in all the roles that I filled. I want to know how your experience as a band director and musician, helped get you to where you are today?

Bobby  7:58  
Me traveling a lot in college, going to different cities to perform. Most of the tours that I went on, with my school out in California that I went to for my undergrad, we were not staying in hotels. We were staying with host homes from either the church we were at, the school that we played at, or the like music venue. People would just volunteer to host us at their house. What that causes you to do is develop some sort of conversational skills. Social intelligence. The ability to have a conversation. Ask leading questions. Listen. Most people don't listen very well in a conversation. I stayed with somebody in a rougher part of Portland, where me and a couple of the other guys in the music group, we literally stayed in their attic on blowup mattresses. Then, the next night, we were outside of Seattle. We stayed with Microsoft executives who had a mansion in Bellevue outside of Seattle, and probably own something on the West Coast, like on the beaches as well. It's all of those different experiences, staying with all those different people, forced us to be able to have a conversation. One of my favorites was in San Francisco. We stayed with an Iranian family who cooked us their you know, their version of curry, lamb shank. We had all these cool foods. We shared in that, and then we talked together afterwards. A lot of people don't have those experiences.

Ali  9:36  
No, I think you're right. Most people don't have those experiences. A lot of Americans grew up in one part of the country and they don't necessarily leave their hometown. I did grew up in the same state. But as a military spouse, I've moved around a lot. I've seen a lot of different things that have also informed my identity much in the way that you just described. And I think those, those skills that you outlined, really helped. I can totally see developed you into being able to fill this role as a mortgage loan officer. And really like asking people questions. Finding out what their goals are. Making these huge financial decisions, which I'm at like the top end of the millennial bracket. We're going to be buying a home the next time that we move, and I can see how your experience would make you a great fit for this type of role. I want to know also, what teacher brain skills made this job a good fit for you and for other teachers?

Bobby  10:35  
Yeah, absolutely. And just to touch on what you just said. I had a friend who shared his experience with a different loan, a mortgage company, and he was just steamrolled for the whole hour and a half that they met. The guy was just talking at them, literally just verbally overpowering them and not letting them really say anything. So the ability to ask questions to your client, what is your goal? Tell me a little bit about your financial situation, all of those things. And then listening. That's going to help you find the right product for your client.

JoDee  11:11  
I was wondering if that listening piece was going to come back full circle here. And it sounds like that is a definite teacher brain skill.

Bobby  11:19  
Absolutely. 

Ali  11:20  
Yeah, and I also think what you just described, like listening to what their financial situation is like. We know that people from all different financial backgrounds buy homes. And so as a teacher, you're used to working with students from all different socio economic communities and backgrounds. And so I think understanding people and families and how they're, they're different, and how they have different needs and experiences is really important. What teacher brain skills make this job a good fit for other teachers?

Bobby  11:52  
I would say feedback loop. The ability to see what the student needs to... in my case, hear them play a musical selection or piece and constantly be providing instruction for them is very much heuristics. If this, then that. So you're constantly when you're educating, trying to figure out the best thing for that kiddo. In the same way, in the mortgage world, the real estate world, you're constantly trying to figure out what's the best thing for your client. Do we need to adjust the homeowners insurance a little bit to help their debt to income ratio? Do they need to be looking at an FHA product instead of a traditional conventional product? All of those different things. You're constantly figuring out what's best fit for them. And then I would also say, one, educational teacher brain skill that definitely transfers is kind of just having a heart posture of service. It's not for your career. You're not necessarily... you're making yourself big and puffed up for your career, you're making yourself more of a servant attitude, to help those students, to help your clients get in that home.

JoDee  13:10  
A lot of teachers have that type of servant leadership, where they go into a role, and they are there to serve others. And with that, and how you differentiate for your clients. How you have such cultural competency about the different types of clients you have. And then also just like listening, for understanding, giving them the stage to share about them before you start making decisions and talking and sharing with them. You have a better understanding of your client. And I think that goes to show that when you're a classroom teacher, rapport is huge. And you can transfer that skill into other professions because that's how you get referrals. That's how you build their trust. That's how you are there for them the next time they decide to buy something. You know, I think that that's really essential in the longevity of having a really positive relationship with your clientele. I wanted to ask you like, is your artistic bucket filled? It sounds like your educational bucket is pretty full. You are still offering kind of your educational expertise, and you're using those skills that you learned but what about artistically?

Bobby  14:24  
Yeah, so I'm still able to play my trumpet a decent amount. And you just kind of find ways to to feel that musical soul that you might have, that artistic soul. Whether it's going to see the Austin symphony, or getting together with other musicians around town and putting on a little concert, or just playing duets trios together. So you have to kind of be intentional about it or it definitely kind just thrown to the wayside. And, and next thing you know, being a trumpet player was something you used to do. And it really doesn't have to be you're a businessman or you're a musician in education. You can do both. Can I tell a really cool story?

Ali  15:11  
Please.

Bobby  15:12  
Okay, so I can continue to be active in the education community, the band community here in Texas. With my new gig, there's flexibility there that I don't have when I was an educator. About a month ago, my friend from college called me up and said, Hey, I was having a clinician down to clean up my bands to help them get ready for competition. He didn't get his passport in time. And you're the only other person that I know that could come down here and help my bands out. Could you do it? Well tell a little bit about my friend, he lives in Grand Cayman Islands. He's a band director at a private school in Grand Cayman Islands. He said, I have the money in my budget to fly you, your wife down. You'll stay with us on the water. You'll get a stipend. You'll get a car. And you'll only teach two hours a day. Literally three weeks ago, in a time where we don't have the money to do that, because we just purchased a new home. We went down to Grand Cayman, spent seven days there, seven nights. And I taught from 12 to noon, all the rest of the time, my wife and I were on the beach with pina coladas.

Ali  16:24  
That's amazing. And it's just such a great opportunity for you to, to help your friend, but also they're getting a band director. Like that was your first profession. And so, you know, if you were still a band director, you wouldn't be able to do that like you said. You would be teaching your own students. You wouldn't be able to take a week off of school. So that's really neat that you got to have that opportunity and, and that you're open to doing things like that now because your career is a little bit more flexible.

Bobby  16:54  
Absolutely. So it doesn't have to be just I do this, or I do this. You can find ways to make your career work for you. And you can find ways to make your career be a vehicle for your personal life, instead of your career completely controlling everything. And then your personal life is just this afterthought.

Ali  17:19  
I think that is a balance that a lot of Americans struggle with. So many times our career is really our, our whole life and identity, especially in teaching. And then we do have to just find space for those other things. But what if, what if our career could be good and fulfilling, but it didn't have to be our everything, right? We still had space to do these other things. Our other passions. So if a teacher is interested in becoming a loan officer, what kind of courses could they take to become one?

Bobby  17:52  
Before we get even into those courses, one thing I want to tell anyone who's interested in being a mortgage loan officer, or even being a real estate agent, an insurance agent that helps people get the correct policies, your first year or two years is your education. And in a way, the money that you're probably not making is your startup cost. Most entrepreneurs have a certain amount of money they have to stick into their business, those first years. And they're maybe not making a ton of money those first couple of years. Your first couple of years, you are constantly networking. You are absolutely meeting lots of people. If you are a introvert, I'm not saying this is not for you, because I know some introverts that have been very successful. But if you're somebody who just wants to stay at your house and not really get out there, this might not be the correct career for you. So yeah, again, have six months reserves in your bank account before you dive off the deep end and you go for something like this. Also know that if you're doing it, more recently, the market is quite turbulent. We have banking failures in California and Switzerland. And it's causing some issues with interest rates. We are predicting that these interest rates settle down and come down eventually. Which will make it more easier for people to buy houses. But currently it is a dogfight out there. And some real estate professionals and mortgage professionals are not being very nice out there. So I want you to go in with your eyes wide open, knowing that you might not make the $200,000, $300,000 you thought you're gonna make. But you hear these glory stories of of so and so just sold a $10 million home, or so and so just got that mortgage, oh my gosh. That will and can happen to you someday, but most likely not in your rookie and sophomore year. If you are really interested in doing this, I suggest that you go to mortgage.nationwidelicensingsystem.org. That is the governing entity that is over the mortgage world. There's going to be 23 hours of coursework that you're going to need to take. And then after that, you're going to need to pass a cumulative exam. On that website that I just mentioned, you can check out the state requirements, because each state's a little bit different. You know, Texas versus Tennessee versus New York. So there might be a little bit different coursework in the state specific course that you take. But yeah, check that website out. The test is something that you definitely need to study for. You will have to memorize federal law, state law, and there is there's a lot of math involved. That test does have a 50% pass rate for the first time that you take it. So it is tough, but you can take it multiple times. You can take it up to three times. But even if you fail three times in a row, there's still some options going forward in the next years where you can retake it.

JoDee  21:13  
How long did it take you to go through all of that?

Bobby  21:16  
I was lucky to have a lot of time during COVID. And my wife and I, we had no kid yet. I wasn't doing a lot of lesson planning, because none of my students were showing up to my class. So I studied, you know, six hours a day type of thing, and took like the month of June to study, do the coursework. And then I passed my test on the first time. Most people they pass it on the second time.

JoDee  21:42  
And so what it sounds like is, it's achievable to do it within a month's time. Maybe a little bit more. So all of those teachers that typically work during the summer, who take on a second job, there's always an option, if you have the financial stability. To think about those summer months, as months to study for tests like this. I'm sure there are tons of teachers that could do it during the school year. Teachers are always in.. going to grad school, getting their PhDs, all of that kind of stuff. But it is something to consider that that timeframe could set them up for the next career phase if they're transitioning.

Bobby  22:20  
Yeah, absolutely. You could take the summer and really just budget your time wisely, and you could do this in the summer for sure.

Ali  22:28  
Well, Bobby, it has been so great having you on the show and learning all about your transition and your career as a mortgage loan officer. And really some takeaways for me is that this field does require studying dedication, knowledge, and bringing in a lot of the teacher brain skills, that to me, I kind of sum it up is like customer service oriented, forward facing. And those would be jobs that would be great for teachers who really have those skills, that enjoy meeting one on one, meeting with people. That's totally me. And so I think that this is a great path for someone who is considering a transition from teaching. And we really appreciate the time that you spent meeting with us and sharing about your transition. 

Bobby  23:15  
Thanks for having me on the show. 

Ali  23:17  
If you'd like to connect with Bobby, you can find links for his Facebook, LinkedIn and website in our show notes. And if you live in the state of Texas, make sure to check out his website: homeloanswithbobby.com.

If you liked The Great Teacher Resignation, give us a five star rating and follow us on Instagram, Facebook, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts, Amazon Music, and Audible. Today's episode was written and recorded by me Alexandra Simon, and my co host JoDee Scissors. Executive produced by Teacher Brain. Produced and edited by Emily Porter. Original Music: Emoji by Tubebackr. Special thanks to our sponsor, Paper Planes Ed.